Hi everyone, this is the first thread for the Vi DAC. Please post thoughts, comments, questions, screenshots, etc. in here. We will be attending to these forums now instead of the IGG pages due to ease of use for both LHL and backers.
Same rules as before: professional-esque discussion over the campaign and LHL is welcome. Personal attacks will not be tolerated and will be deleted. Profanity: try to keep it PG, please.
There is no "quote" function on the forum but I am working with Freshdesk support to see if there is a workaround. But this will be infinitely better than the old system at IGG where there was no ability to edit posts, a character count, no way to post screens, etc.
We look forward to hearing from you around the forums!
I posted this 2 months ago but it apparently didn't go through so I am posting again...
I think that is going to be hard to do Robert. Consider the following taken directly off Indiegogo:
Campaign Backers when campaign closed % Funded
Geek Wave: ~9600 $1,665,254 3478% on July 13, 2014
Geek Wave #2: ~800 $190,000 148% of $128,000
Geek Pulse DAC: ~13,400 $3,001,353 3089% on Dec 28, 2013
Geek Pulse #2: ~550 $103,527 20705% of $500 fixed goal
Pulse Analog: ~260 $93,966 1649% on Oct 1, 2015
Vi DAC: ~1150 $283,406 2852% on March 16, 2015
Total Reported funds contributed: $5,629,225
These numbers may not reflect all of the perks, direct invoices, etc. which may have taken place after the campaigns closed. Even with overlap, that’s 20,000+ backers from all over the world. I have a hard time believing that ~20k backers contributing ~5.6M are going to let all this just go.
I agree with you about these products becoming “legacy”. I am fortunate in that I have the ability to move on (and I have, substituting new products which I have purchased to take the place of these “potential products” which may or may not ever show up). But while you and I may be able to tap out and take the loss as a poor investment opportunity, hard to imagine that many others will feel the same…again, nor should they.
I think if the communication were better and consisted of something other than teases like the September 5, 2018 update (noted above by John Siegel):
“We have the new Vi chassis design ready…we will post the photo of the new chassis once we receive it. It should be in three weeks.”
Promise unkept. Rather than update again on Sept 26 letting people know what’s happening, nothing happens.
In the last year regarding just Vi DAC, there have been 7 updates, and many updates address the chassis or Mr. Ho’s world travels. All tease, no meat, irregularly irregular positive reinforcement (the most addictive kind, just like gambling). When you click on the campaign Facebook links for Mr. Ho, you get https://www.facebook.com/app_scoped_user_id/660315531/ which no longer exists. Same for https://www.facebook.com/app_scoped_user_id/110875392609110/ . There is a twitter (https://twitter.com/geekbylhlabs) who’s last meaningful post was from Feb of 2017. Talk about a ruined reputation.
(note: extra part deleted for encouragement of harassment towards journalists and LHL employees and associates)
(second note: second deletion. discussion of legal action towards LHL is not permitted on this site)
Let's just go with the new chassis so production and fulfillment to backers can move forward. I do not need the fancy, problem prone chassis.
Regarding the chassis question - it isn't clear to me which is the fast way forward. The production of the solid state ViDac with the old chassis apparently went off without too many problems (?). The tube chassis is not that much different, at least from my outsider's perspective. If indeed there has been an unacceptable reject rate from the beginning and the machining company who can make that awesome looking tank can't make our chassis, then maybe its time (or even past time) to throw in the towel.
Right now the information on the new chassis is scarce. Is it only a drawing or has there been a working prototype? Is this the way to a commercial product? With limited resources, LH Labs needs to be clear what it can and cannot support. I would like my tube ViDAC to arrive this year and to sound wonderful - even if its chassis has a blemish or two or it's a rectangular solid.
The chassis story never held water at all, the fact they said all Vi DAC Solid State units had shipped, but that boring two holes in that very same chassis for the vacuum tubes somehow was monumentally more complicated and error/defect prone. Right.
Probably both stories were untrue, i.e. they hadn't shipped all of the solid state units, ands the 1 year+ old story of developing special tooling etc needed in order to drill the two holes for the tubes providing any special challenge to a competent machine shop.
LH Labs simply never placed any order for those chassis, at best they had samples and prototypes.
Now we wait 6 months for the new chassis, with nary a detail provided, and Larry knows he's worn everyone out, and that no one in their right mind would hold out for the original chassis at this point. So those cool looking chassis we were all sold on in the IGG campaign won't be offered, perhaps ever, but certainly not for IGG backers. Maybe for someone willing to pay $7k retail for a "Pro" version.
Customer Service: Noted the Indiegogo comment from LH labs - hopefully the prototype cases turn out fine. Looks like the prototype run will arrive in a couple of weeks or so. Could you post pictures of the new chassis?
We should have the prototype cases in 20 days to our offices. Then we’ll do some minor adjustments and start the finalized chassis. This chassis will be much faster to produce than the original.
@Conrad I will try my hardest to get those pictures for you.
for all of us maybe?
says samples, so no way is there enough parts in the system to make the 200 units that are left to go.
we probably won't even get a build schedule when they approve the samples - remember we we at 15 units a month when they started the delays
We expect the new chassis prototype completely done by the first week of June. I am going to post pictures when/if I get them so everyone can see what we have.
I hope I won't sound too harsh saying this, I do not think we care about how the new chassis looks like anymore.
As far as I understand we won't have the choice, besides it is more important to finally get our perks than argue on chassis design details.
Also because Source (meant to par with Vi) looks so different from the original Vi design I won't mind harmonisation.
What does not make me happy is that the Vi I have on order costed me $3011 and it won't be among the SE priority batch.
As I said, I would not mind loosing the tubes and the CCX8 module and jump in the SS SE version and get my unit sooner.
Also with a budget of $3011 I would have bought quit a good DAC today, because I have some privilege in some companies a 3K budget means a 4.5K or 5K street priced unit. My Sony NW-WM1Z costed me less than the 2K I have backed for the Wave and I do mean way less !
@Mike M. not all sold state devices have shipped. I'm still waiting for mine.
To my full knowledge and understanding, the original chassis will remain for those who want it.
The "prototype" will be done at the beginning of June, then likely another month or two before they begin being produced and Vi DACs are assembled using them. At best, we're looking at 2019 before those of us Indiegogo contributors FINALLY receive our DACs. In the meantime, many, like me, have had to purchase another brand DAC in order to use our systems.
I'm also a Source contributor--guess what? I've purchased a Melco Music Library because it'll be months and months before they are delivered.
I'm about to purchase another device to use with my Audeze headphones because 2 years down the line, I still don't have my Geek Wave.
I've been super-patient, but that has run its course.
Keeping the old chassis with all the build problems we have been repported does not make sense to me.
I do understand those who prefer the old version, I do too it looks really nice and unique.
My current worries is to get my orders ASAP. So again, any sacrifies in my orders that would help getting my stuff the fastest as possible, I will agree on.
I remember you did told me that you would look into it and than might not be possible. Because the wait is so long I have a hard time taking NO for an answer. Besides I think my request is reasonable.
Jarek, keep in mind that I am grateful for your help in this and that I understand that you are sitting in the worst seat possible.
So again, thank you for your time and comitment.
@Jeff Your request is still in the system. Let's see what the new chassis brings as far as design and build speed, and we can discuss your unit further in depth. Until the chassis is actually finalized and we know exactly what we're dealing with, there's not a whole lot that can be done with your request.
Now as far as "B Stock"goes (which you also requested), I'm still waiting on information over the "new" B Stock. I think we had about 3 or 4 of them total and I know for a fact we sent those out already. So right now I'm just waiting on information from the office on when we will actually have more for those backers who requested it.